• The MHP Brokers Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails Interview with Broker Paul Schaaf Regarding His Sale of a Challenging Mobile Home Park in West Virginia
    Oct 26 2024

    In this episode of The MHP Broker’s Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails podcast, Maxwell Baker, president of The Mobile Home Park Broker, interviewed The MHP Broker’s Paul Schaaf regarding his recent sale of a storage facility, mobile home park and RV community in Parkersburg, West Virginia.

    As with every Tips and Tricks podcast episode, this one is brought to you by The MHP Broker's proprietary Community Price Maximizer. Use this four-step system to get the highest price possible for your mobile home park or RV community when you sell it through The MHP Broker. Guaranteed. Call Max for details.

    Here Are the Show Highlights:

    • Max introduced broker Paul Schaaf to discuss his sale of Gihon Self Storage Facility and RV Park in Parkersburg, West Virginia. (00:22)
    • The owner had acquired the park as part of a bankruptcy settlement, so his heart wasn’t really in it. He was running it from out of state. It had three verticals: a mobile home park, RV community and self-storage facility. He had a good on-site manager taking care of the day-to-daay, but contacted Paul because he was getting unsolicited offers. The self-storage vertical was running pretty well, with 150 units and about 75 percent occupancy. The mobile home vertical was a mess, though. A lot of houses in poor shape that had to be taken out. The offers were generally just for the self-storage business, but the owner wanted to sell everything as a single unit. They put together a nice marketing package and had multiple offers. The seller had a nice financing program, which helped attract qualified buyers. (Paul, 1:12)
    • The owners offered self financing on a portion of the loan at about five percent with a three-year balloon payment. (Paul, 3:15)
    • The deal went well, even though the buyer was taking on the mobile home vertical that needed a lot of work. The deal closed in about 45 days. (Paul, 3:49)
    • The buyer was someone Paul had worked with in the past. They had money from family and friends, and had invested in commercial properties before. They were just getting into buying mobile home parks, and had a few properties. Having worked with him before, Paul trusted that they could close without major issues, and that’s what happened. (Paul, 4:05)
    • Paul’s takeaway was that sellers must be patient, especially if they have properties that are challenging to sell. This one, for instance, had problem houses that had to be removed and replaced. But when you have good buyers and sellers, as he did here, the deal can go quickly and smoothly and be a pleasure to work. (Paul, 4:49)

    Bring us your most challenging deals. At The Mobile Home Broker, we have years of experience selling mobile home parks, RV communities and all of the other verticals that might be part of the transaction. Call Paul Schaaf or Max Baker at The MHP Broker, (678) 932-0200. Op drop ‘em a line at info@themhpbroker.com.

    Power Quotes in This Episode:

    “We are good at those deals in the secondary, tertiary markets. Don't get me wrong. We do big deals. I mean, we just closed a nice $9 million deal recently, and have done upwards toward the multi-million dollar deals as well, up in the 30s. So, we do a lot of deals. We do all types.” (Max, 5:23)

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    7 mins
  • The MHP Brokers Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails Interview with Broker Jeff Dodge Regarding His Sale of an Appealing Two-Park Portfolio
    Oct 19 2024

    In this episode of The MHP Broker’s Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails podcast, Maxwell Baker, president of The Mobile Home Park Broker, interviewed The MHP Broker Jeff Dodge regarding his recent sale of a beautiful two-park portfolio.

    As with every Tips and Tricks podcast episode, this one is brought to you by The MHP Broker's proprietary Community Price Maximizer. Use this four-step system to get the highest price possible for your mobile home park or RV community when you sell it through The MHP Broker. Guaranteed. Call Max for details.

    Here Are the Show Highlights:

    • Max explained how he and broker Jeff Dodge worked together on the sale of a two-park portfolio, with Jeff doing the majority of the work. (Max, 00:22)
    • The park seller had been in the business for a long time, having bought and sold many parks. These two parks were big and beautiful. Together, Eagle Trace and Edgewood consisted of 116 park-owned homes, 11 tenant-owned homes and nine vacant lots. The parks were very well maintained and the homes were new or impressively renovated. Everything was direct billed, making it more of a turnkey operation for the buyer. There was also an opportunity for value-add rent increases. (Jeff, 1:23)
    • There were also park-dedicated roads throughout both properties. And the parks carried an asking price of a CAP rate that was above 6. (Max, 2:31)
    • Rents averaged at about $100 under market value, a major selling point for fairly immediate increased revenue generation. (Jeff, 3:39)
    • One major challenge Jeff foresaw was the presence of all of the park-owned homes–116 of them in total. This can sometimes be a sale obstacle if prospective owners don’t want the cost and responsibility of having to maintain homes they own. Despite all the park-owned homes, the portfolio received multiple offers. (Jeff, 3:58)
    • They ended up in negotiations with three serious buyers. (Jeff, 4:24)
    • The park owner also had an office building that he wasn’t going to include in the deal. Max convinced him to keep that in his pocket as a possible bargaining chip. Sure enough, they were able to add the building to the deal and pull down an additional quarter-million dollars. This was a tactic Max had learned in the process of selling some 500 mobile home parks over time. (Max, 4:30)
    • The story has a happy ending. Buyer and seller were both happy with the transaction. (Jeff, 5:53)

    The Mobile Home Broker has years of experience selling mobile home parks, and the brokers know tricks of the trade that can help you get maximum price on your park. Call Jeff Dodge or Max Baker at The MHP Broker, (678) 932-0200. Op drop ‘em a line at info@themhpbroker.com.

    Power Quotes in This Episode:

    “So, you know, you're worried about the financing aspect and finding that right buyer that's willing to take on 116 park-owned homes. But, you know, ultimately, we received multiple offers.” (Jeff, 3:58)

    “I want to say I’ve probably sold well over 500 mobile home parks in my career.” (Max, 4:30)

    “...issues can come up at any time up until closing, but it seems like we always find a good resolution. Yeah, we got it to the finish line. Both parties were happy with the outcome.” (Jeff, 5:53)

    “I've moved the ugliest thing on the street to the most beautiful park, like this one. We do all sorts of stuff.” (Max, 6:14)

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    8 mins
  • The MHP Brokers Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails Interview with Broker Paul Schaaf About Trails West Mobile Home Park
    Oct 12 2024
    In this episode of The MHP Broker’s Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails podcast, Maxwell Baker, president of The Mobile Home Park Broker, chatted withThe MHP Broker’s Paul Schaaf about his recent closing on a mobile home park in Flowery Branch, Georgia. As with every Tips and Tricks podcast episode, this one is brought to you by The MHP Broker's proprietary Community Price Maximizer. Use this four-step system to get the highest price possible for your mobile home park or RV community when you sell it through The MHP Broker. Guaranteed. Call Max for details. Here Are the Show Highlights: Max asked broker Paul Schaaf to discuss his Trails West Mobile Home Park in Georgia. The park included a little lakefront property on Lake Lanier, a definite feature attraction for prospective buyers. (Max, 00:22)Trails West MHP is in Flowery Branch, a very desirable community near Lake Lanier in northern Georgia. It’s got a good school system and home values have skyrocketed. (Paul 1:30)The sellers were mostly involved with the development of single-family homes. (Max, 1:44)The selling group actually consisted of four investors, which brought added challenges. Paul had to make sure that everyone was on board for every decision and marketing strategy. It was a large and highly ranked park, so selling it was a major endeavor. (Pal, 2:05)The property has city water and city sewer, always desirable factors for buyers. The owners had made major investments in infrastructure, including electrical. But there was still ample opportunity for buyers, including the infilling of about 30 lots and rents that were about $200 under market rates. So while a buyer was getting a park in excellent condition, there was still plenty of “meat on the bone” in terms of adding value. (Paul, 2:56)The buyers held a short-term loan and made a large down payment to attain seller financing. It was a very smooth transaction and both parties were happy with the outcome. No major hiccups at all. (Paul, 3:40)The buyers were a man and woman who Max had done business with on more than one occasion. In addition to having a good buyer pool, as this sale proves, The MHP Broker takes the competitive edge with great customer service and effective process orientation, the use of relevant data and the ability to put investors and motivated lenders together. (Max, 4:27)This deal, with 150 pads, was larger than what Paul usually sees, but he was thrilled to have the opportunity to handle Trails West along with the small and medium-size deals he’s more accustomed to. (Paul, 6:03)The brokers at The MHP Broker all have the talent and instincts to form good working relationships with buyers and sellers, which helps them get ahead of any problems that might come up, and move the transaction successfully forward. (Paul, 7:52) You got a large mobile home park or RV community you’re thinking of putting on the market? Medium? Small? Whatever the size of our manufactured home community, Paul Schaaf and the other brokers at The Mobile Home Broker have the experience and the knack for selling it at your optimal price. Call Paul or Max Baker at (678) 932-0200 or drop us a line at info@themhpbroker.com Power Quotes in This Episode: (Regarding this deal) “I think the buyer benefited from all that work, and that was what was appetizing for them. The work was already done and there was still meat on the bone with infilling about 30-some odd lots. The rents were, you know, I want to say $200 below market.” (Paul, 2:56) ”It was just a very smooth transaction…both sides of the table were very satisfied.” (Paul, 3:40) "Y'all, we have the same buyer pool (as the competitors). It's really about customer service, and it's really about knowing the local markets, and it's really …about the data that we have, that we've all dug up personally here at the company, and just the amount of value that we add to the situation. We've seen a thing or two. I mean, we've got other competitors out there that forget to check whether or not the money's been deposited in escrow. We're here at our firm. We're very, very like clockwork, yeah, systematic, yeah.” (Max, 4:27) “...we’ve been there and done it. And at the end of the day, we’re gonna get the job done.” (Max, 5:21) "I think that it's always fun times on these larger deals, and count on us to continue to be in whatever market we're in. Even with these higher interest rates, we can put deals together that make sense for all parties.” (Paul, 6:39) “(It’s) our job is to be two, three steps ahead of any catastrophic drama that would affect that deal. That's why our closing ratio is north of 86 percent. Once we put a deal on our contract, we typically close it because we've done impeccable upfront due diligence on your community or communities, and we try and get debt lined up.” (Max, 6:55)
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    10 mins
  • The MHP Brokers Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails Interview with Broker Jeff Dodge Regarding His New Beginning Mobile Home Park Closing
    Oct 5 2024
    In this episode of The MHP Broker’s Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails podcast, Maxwell Baker, president of The Mobile Home Park Broker, interviewed The MHP Broker Jeff Dodge regarding his recent sale of New Beginnings MHP despite losing the first buyer to financing hassles. As with every Tips and Tricks podcast episode, this one is brought to you by The MHP Broker's proprietary Community Price Maximizer. Use this four-step system to get the highest price possible for your mobile home park or RV community when you sell it through The MHP Broker. Guaranteed. Call Max for details. Here Are the Show Highlights: Max wanted to start with a heads-up to buddy Steve Massell, who came up with the “Closing Cocktails” concept of quick hit podcast interviews. Then he hailed company broker Jeff Dodge for his success with New Beginnings MHP, a nice community that got multiple offers and a quick, relatively painless close. (Max, 00:22)The owner was selling because they lived out of state and had experienced difficulties in managing the park from afar. New Beginnings had a lot of very appealing features, including city water and sewer direct-billed to tenants, and newer-model park-owned homes. The community was very clean and well maintained. Twenty-nine of the 32 lots had homes and were occupied. So there was some value-add opportunity filling those last three pads. Jeff felt that the location might be the biggest hurdle he’d face in that it was fairly isolated, and not within easy reach of retail establishments or the interstate system. That didn’t seem to faze prospective buyers, though. The property got multiple offers quickly. Their first choice of buyer couldn’t get financing, but Jeff already had a second buyer waiting in the wings. Jeff helped this buyer get financing from a credit union The MHP Brokers have worked with in the past. There were no additional hang-ups from that moment on, and the sale closed in a timely manner. (Jeff, 1:37)As an additional buyer incentive, the privately owned roads were paved. (Jeff, 2:58)The buyer was an experienced real estate investor, but mostly in other asset classes. He did have some familiarity with mobile home investments. Jeff enjoyed working with him and hopes to do business with him more in the future. (Jeff, 3:11)One of the lessons Jeff took home from this deal was the importance of having a backup buyer whenever possible. That’s important because financing today can be tricky, and your first deal might easily fall through. (Jeff, 3:53)lJeff also appreciates how the company was able to list the park with a realistic price point before going on the market. That’s why they were able to get a full-price offer and close the deal so quickly and smoothly. (Jeff, 5:22) One key seller advantage is The Mobile Home Broker’s network of motivated lenders. Call Jeff Dodge or Max Baker at The MHP Broker, (678) 932-0200 and we’ll help you find–and find financing for–a qualified buyer. Or drop us a line at info@themhpbroker.com. Power Quotes in This Episode: (Regarding his buyer on this deal) “It was great working with him, and I look forward to working with him in the future.” (Jeff, 3:11) “You know, it's kind of a tricky market with financing out there, but you always want to have your backups ready to go.” (Jeff, 3:53) “It was a win-win for both parties, because the buyer got a turnkey (deal), but a little upside as well, and then the seller could take that money and invest it in something a little bit closer to home.” (Jeff, 3:53) “We can find the right buyer for you. This is a great example, so just give us the opportunity.” (Jeff, 4:26) “Yeah, we're able to move stuff, y'all, even though the market right now is a little tricky with the financing, We are still able to get deals done. A lot of our competitors are out there stooping to buying listings, if you want to call it that, where they promise the pie in the sky type of price. In reality, they know that it's not going to sell for that. They're just literally trying to look busy. We don't do that, y'all. We will give you a No BS evaluation on your community.” (Max, 4:31) “This was priced where we sold it, you know, full asking price. So, it tells you our valuations. We're right on the money here. So definitely work with us. We're gonna give you a true market value that's fair, and we're gonna get you the most money that you possibly can, for sure. (Jeff, 5:22)"
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    9 mins
  • The MHP Brokers Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails Interview with Broker Jeff Dodge Regarding His New Beginning Mobile Home Park Closing
    Sep 28 2024

    In this episode of The MHP Broker’s Tips and Tricks Closing Cocktails podcast, Maxwell Baker, president of The Mobile Home Park Broker, interviewed The MHP Broker Jeff Dodge regarding his recent sale of New Beginnings MHP despite losing the first buyer to financing hassles.

    As with every Tips and Tricks podcast episode, this one is brought to you by The MHP Broker's proprietary Community Price Maximizer. Use this four-step system to get the highest price possible for your mobile home park or RV community when you sell it through The MHP Broker. Guaranteed. Call Max for details.

    Here Are the Show Highlights:

    • Max wanted to start with a heads-up to buddy Steve Massell, who came up with the “Closing Cocktails” concept of quick hit podcast interviews. Then he hailed company broker Jeff Dodge for his success with New Beginnings MHP, a nice community that got multiple offers and a quick, relatively painless close. (Max, 00:22)
    • The owner was selling because they lived out of state and had experienced difficulties in managing the park from afar. New Beginnings had a lot of very appealing features, including city water and sewer direct-billed to tenants, and newer-model park-owned homes. The community was very clean and well maintained. Twenty-nine of the 32 lots had homes and were occupied. So there was some value-add opportunity filling those last three pads. Jeff felt that the location might be the biggest hurdle he’d face in that it was fairly isolated, and not within easy reach of retail establishments or the interstate system. That didn’t seem to faze prospective buyers, though. The property got multiple offers quickly. Their first choice of buyer couldn’t get financing, but Jeff already had a second buyer waiting in the wings. Jeff helped this buyer get financing from a credit union The MHP Brokers have worked with in the past. There were no additional hang-ups from that moment on, and the sale closed in a timely manner. (Jeff, 1:37)
    • As an additional buyer incentive, the privately owned roads were paved. (Jeff, 2:58)
    • The buyer was an experienced real estate investor, but mostly in other asset classes. He did have some familiarity with mobile home investments. Jeff enjoyed working with him and hopes to do business with him more in the future. (Jeff, 3:11)
    • One of the lessons Jeff took home from this deal was the importance of having a backup buyer whenever possible. That’s important because financing today can be tricky, and your first deal might easily fall through. (Jeff, 3:53)l
    • Jeff also appreciates how the company was able to list the park with a realistic price point before going on the market. That’s why they were able to get a full-price offer and close the deal so quickly and smoothly. (Jeff, 5:22)

    One key seller advantage is The Mobile Home Broker’s network of motivated lenders. Call Jeff Dodge or Max Baker at The MHP Broker, (678) 932-0200 and we’ll help you find–and find financing for–a qualified buyer. Or drop us a line at info@themhpbroker.com.

    Power Quotes in This Episode:

    (Regarding his buyer on this deal) “It was great working with him, and I look forward to working with him in the future.” (Jeff, 3:11)

    “You know, it's kind of a tricky market with financing out there, but you always want to have your backups ready to go.” (Jeff, 3:53)

    “It was a win-win for both parties, because the buyer got a turnkey (deal), but a little upside as well, and then the seller could take that money and invest it in something a little bit closer to home.” (Jeff, 3:53)

    “We can find the right buyer for you. This is a great example, so just give us the opportunity.” (Jeff, 4:26)

    “Yeah, we're able to move stuff, y'all, even though the market right now is a little tricky with the financing, We are still able to get deals done. A lot of our competitors are out there stooping to buying listings, if you want to call it that, where they promise the pie in the sky type of price. In reality, they know that it's not going to sell for that. They're just literally trying to look busy. We don't do that, y'all. We will give you a No BS evaluation on your community.” (Max, 4:31)

    “This was priced where we sold it, you know, full asking price. So, it tells you our valuations. We're right on the money here. So definitely work with us. We're gonna give you a true market value that's fair, and we're gonna get you the most money that you possibly can, for sure. (Jeff, 5:22)

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    7 mins
  • The MHP Brokers Tips and Tricks Podcast Summarizing The Mobile Home Park Broker’s Buyers Guide
    1 hr and 31 mins
  • The MHP Brokers Tips and Tricks Interview with Broker Eric Wanck Regarding a Recent Mobile Home Park Sale in Southern Alabama
    Sep 14 2024

    In this episode of The MHP Broker’s Tips and Tricks podcast, Maxwell Baker, president of The Mobile Home Park Broker, interviewed The MHP Broker Eric Wanck regarding his sale of a small park in a tertiary market in southern Alabama with a challenging appraisal.

    As with every Tips and Tricks podcast episode, this one is brought to you by The MHP Broker's proprietary Community Price Maximizer. Use this four-step system to get the highest price possible for your mobile home park or RV community when you sell it through The MHP Broker. Guaranteed. Call Max for details.

    Here Are the Show Highlights:

    • The MHPBroker Eric Wanck recently sold a small park, for the second time, in a tertiary market in southern Alabama–but not without its challenges (Max, 0:22)
    • The park made for a challenging sale because it was small, with less than 30 pads, and had an abundance of park-owned homes (POH) and rent-to-own (RTO) homes, On the other hand, it had city water and a good septic system. There was plenty of buyer interest, and Eric found a buyer with some industry experience, but not a whole lot. The buyer needed help getting financing, and Eric and The MP Broker were able to find a good debt source. (Eric, 1:22)
    • However, the appraisal process became a hitch. The bank appraisers came back low. Eric didn’t give up on the deal, but got his clients to hit the middle ground on price so the deal could go through to the satisfaction of all parties. This took a little more time than he would have liked, but they were able to close in five or six months. (Eric, 2:55)
    • The appraisers didn’t appreciate the presence of the several POHs. They didn’t take into consideration the significant rent deposits due to all of those POHs and RTOs. Eric worked with the lenders to get that stable income considered, but it was the kind of challenge that park sellers always run into when selling properties with a lot of POHs. Lenders tend to see that as more of a liability than the consistent income-producing asset it might be. (Eric, 4:22)
    • At the end of the day, Eric and the MHP Broker team knew how to handle the obstacles, and they kept in constant communication with the appraisers and put together a deal that was beneficial to their client as well as the buyer. (Eric, 5:56)

    Even the toughest obstacles can be overcome if you have talented and experienced mobile home park brokers on your side. At The MHP Broker, we guarantee a park sale at the highest possible price. Call Eric Wanck or Max Baker at The Mobile Home Park Broker, (678) 932-0200. You can also drop us a line at info@themhpbroker.com.

    Power Quotes in This Episode:

    “...because we had buyers coming to us left and right, saying ‘How am I going to get this done?’ and we provided that solution.” (Eric, 1:28)

    “We're not biased. As long as you can come and you can show that you can get the deal done, we will work with you.” (Eric, 1:28)

    “...we always figure out a way to get it done, and that's what we pride ourselves in, that we're not just going to toss up our hands and say, ‘Let's cancel the contract.’“ (Eric, 2:55)

    “We do our best in terms of marketing and providing information to the appraisers.” (Eric, 4:22)

    “At the end of the day, every deal has a little bit of its bumps, and this one did with the appraisal, but the good news is that we knew how to navigate it, and we got it to the closing table.” (Eric, 5:56)

    “We do sell the easier ones, which most brokers are fighting over. The ones that they don't fight over are the ones that we are very good at, and those are the value-add deals. We don't mind getting our hands dirty, albeit, we do like the easier ones out there, but, you know, obviously not every mobile home park out there is a beauty up front. They're just diamonds in the rough, and we are very good, especially Eric, at explaining how the next buyer coming into the deal will be able to make some money.” (Max, 6:12)

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    8 mins
  • The MHP Brokers Tips and Tricks Interview with Broker Eric Wanck Regarding Five Points MHP
    Sep 6 2024

    In this episode of The MHP Broker’s Tips and Tricks podcast, Maxwell Baker, president of The Mobile Home Park Broker, interviewed The MHP Broker Eric Wanck regarding his sale of Five Points Mobile Home Park, and the challenges that wereinvolved.

    As with every Tips and Tricks podcast episode, this one is brought to you by The MHP Broker's proprietary Community Price Maximizer. Use this four-step system to get the highest price possible for your mobile home park or RV community when you sell it through The MHP Broker. Guaranteed. Call Max for details.

    Here Are the Show Highlights:

    • Super broker Eric Wanck recently sold Five Points Mobile Home Park, though not without a little drama. (Max, 0:22)
    • From the outside looking in, it was a great park. Five Points is in a favorable metro, it has a good, solid resident base, all tenant-owned homes, with direct-billed city water and sewer. Everything investors are looking for. (Eric, 1:28)
    • On top of all other buyer advantages, the park was priced at an almost 11% CAP. (Eric, 1:56)
    • The reason for the high CAP is that the tenant-owned homes were all pretty old and run down, from the late 1970s and early 80s. (Eric, 2:10)
    • Max remembers being highly unimpressed with the homes as he rode through the park, inspecting it and taking pictures. He knew then it would be a hard sale. (Max, 2:28)
    • The seller had approached Eric probably about a year before the sale, and asked him to evaluate the property. Eric appraised it and recommended that the owner spend a little money on improvements. The seller did so, and Eric was ultimately able to get about $800,000 more for the property than he had originally thought it would sell for. (Eric, 2:44)
    • They got a lot of interest in the park, and the high bidder was a man who owned real estate, but had never owned a mobile home park. He already had a lender in place, but the lender got nervous. It made so many unrealistic demands that it looked like they didn’t really want to fund the deal. (Eric, 5:36)
    • One and a half weeks before the proposed close date, the lender pulled out of the deal. Fortunately, the buyer was already in backup communication with another lender who came into the deal. They were able to complete the sale in 30 days with the new lender, and that included a new appraisal. (Eric, 6:36)
    • The prospective buyer was a little gun shy with the appraisal, based on what he’d already been through with a lender, and the general aesthetics of the park with the old homes, so he did something Eric had never seen before. Even though he wasn’t the owner yet, he paid about $10,000 out of his own pocket to improve the look of the park. The strategy worked. The appraisal went through without a hitch, and the park was sold. Proof that even a drama-filled transaction can be successfully overcome with experienced mobile home park brokers. (Eric, 7:33)

    We can’t guarantee a total lack of drama, but we do guarantee a park sale at the highest possible price. That’s the bottom line. Call Eric Wanck or Max Baker at The Mobile Home Park Broker, (678) 932-0200. You can also drop us a line at info@themhpbroker.com.

    Power Quotes in This Episode:

    “It’s not a deal without drama, bro.” (Max, 3:38)

    “Every Tuesday, we talk about all the deals that we're working on. We talk about all the drama that everybody's coming across. We are a giant think tank for you, the seller and the buyer. So that's why you pay us.” (Max, 4:21)

    “It just goes to show that you always run into something with these transactions…great cash flowing park definitely had its rough edges, but I think at the end of the day he's going to be very happy here, in the long run, with the asset that he purchased.” (Eric, 7:33)

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    10 mins