David Gerard is one of Silicon Valley's most sought-after magicians and mentalists, performing over 90 shows annually for Fortune 500 companies and tech industry leaders. Before pursuing magic full-time, David spent 12 years in tech, starting at Google where he worked on flagship products including YouTube, AdWords, and Google Play, before leading growth and marketing initiatives at Discord and Aalto. Now, David combines his expertise in product growth with his mastery of psychological principles from magic, consulting with series A and B startups while maintaining a rigorous performance schedule that includes over 60 shows at Hollywood's prestigious Magic Castle. His unique background bridging tech and magic makes him a distinctive voice on user psychology, attention, and engagement.

In our conversation, we unpack:

• A magician's secret for creating engaging experiences

• How magic shows achieve retention (and what products can learn from it)

• The misdirection technique that can transform user experiences

• What magicians know about building trust that most companies miss

• The surprising way performers make experiences feel personalized at scale

From Google to the stage, David Gerard has mastered both tech product growth and performance magic. In this episode, he reveals the psychological principles behind great magic shows and how product teams can apply them to create experiences users can't look away from. A must-listen for growth, product and design leaders looking to add a touch of magic to their user experience.

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Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs⁠here⁠.

Orson Scott Card is the author of Ender’s Game, one of the most influential science fiction novels ever written, and its sequel Speaker for the Dead, among other bestselling works. Ender’s Game is widely read in schools across the US and has been included in some educational curricula. In our conversation, we explore:

• His approach to creating page-turners: Why telling users what's coming beats clever "hooks"

• His method of ensuring the reader understands his writing (great for design teams)

• His unique perspective to character development that could help with customer interviews

• The one trick Orson uses for getting real feedback

This episode teaches product teams how to apply storytelling principles to build more engaging, intuitive products. Whether you're working on marketing, user experience, or team leadership, Orson Scott Card's insights on crafting immersive narratives that respect both audience and reality offer valuable lessons for anyone building products people love (and pay for).

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.
Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs⁠here⁠.

Kristina Gibson most recently was the CPO at Dott, accelerating their growth to over 100M rides annually. She led the merger with TIER to form Europe’s largest e-bike and scooter operator.

She is a former Director of Product at Booking.com, where she pioneered user growth strategy across global markets. As an early product leader at Lyft, she architected the company's expansion into new cities and innovative verticals.

At Eventbrite, Kristina transformed the business from a US-only operation to a powerhouse platform across 20+ markets, founding and scaling teams throughout Europe and Latin America.

Kristina began her career at Intuit, building international payments that transformed how small businesses pay vendors across borders. When Mint.com was acquired by Intuit, she drove their expansion into new markets. She holds five patents.

In this episode, we explore:

When to rely on A/B tests compared to taking bigger strategic bets

The hidden psychology behind last-minute purchase decisions

Why showing unavailable options can drive more conversions

The unexpected power of surfacing micro-details in product listings

How to balance user preferences with innovation risks

This episode is packed with insights from a trailblazing product leader who has run thousands of experiments at top product growth companies. It's essential listening for teams looking to shape user behavior through thoughtful product decisions.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.
Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs ⁠here⁠.

Dan Petroski is the founder and winemaker of Massican Wines. Massican was recently acquired by Gallo and is the only solely white wine producer in Napa Valley—a region famed for reds. Dan is known as a world-class marketer, combining storytelling, positioning and distribution insights to make Massican what it is today. In our conversation, we discuss:

• The theory of pricing (and the sweet spot in wine pricing)

• Why you should build your distribution channel before the product

• The key to building a premium brand experience

• Massican’s secret for reducing risk in a very risky market

• How to use language to build customer confidence

This episode is packed with fresh insights onpricing psychology,brand storytelling, and the art (and behavioral science) of crafting memorablecustomer experiences.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs⁠⁠here⁠⁠.

Joel Burgess, co-founder of Soft Rains, andDan Vader, Creative Director at Capybara Games, are the minds behind Grindstone, one of the most acclaimed indie puzzle games in recent years. Joel has worked on iconic titles like Watch Dogs: Legion and Skyrim. Dan, a long-time creative force at Capybara, has shaped the studio’s reputation with beloved games like Superbrothers: Sword & Sworcery EP. Together, Joel and Dan bring a fresh perspective on game design, combining narrative depth with challenging gameplay mechanics to engage players at a deeper level.

In this episode, we explore:

• Which types of game mechanics drive retention

• What game designers know about onboarding users

• What game designers have learned about leaderboards

• How pricing influences user behavior

• Tips on simplifying complex experiences (and when to make them more complex)

Loaded with actionable insights, this episode is a must-listen for growth and design teams looking to build lasting engagement through intrinsic motivation and thoughtfully designed user experiences.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.
Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labs⁠here⁠.

Cal Thompson is the VP of Product Design & Research at Headspace, where they lead a team dedicated to creating user-centered designs that drive real-world impact. Their focus is to combine design practices with rigorous research to help users achieve their meditation goals. Before Headspace, Cal served as a Design Director at Fjord San Francisco. In this episode, we explore:

• What key metric Headspace measures for active use

• The small feature change that increased engagement

• The one trick they use for copy-editing

• What drives people to re-engage with Headspace

• How pricing (free vs. paid) impacts user engagement

This episode is packed with practical takeaways for PMs and anyone interested in the psychology of habit creation.

Enjoy this episode? Rate it and leave a review. It really helps others find the podcast.

Learn more about Kristen and Irrational Labshere.

Trying something new is hard at the macro level. Yelp reviews reduce that uncertainty that comes with new things. But how do they help businesses achieve organic and meaningful reviews? In this episode, host Kristen Berman is joined by Akhil Kuduvalli Ramesh, VP of Consumer Product at Yelp. He explains why Yelp prefers quality over quantity when it comes to reviews and how your Yelp review creates community and helps new businesses. They also talk about high-frequency low-risk experience while taking a look at some studies and other companies’ strategies, like Spotify’s approximate nearest neighbor search. Stay tuned and learn the many features that are promoting human connection at Yelp!

Jump straight into:

(01:17) - Engineering behind a review: Reminders, thank you notes and opportune timing to enhance more reviews.

(07:42) - Why do people write reviews? The common denominators the most frequent Yelp contributors share.

(13:19) - Promoting human connection: The best hacks to make first reviews flow organically and be longer.

(16:57 - Understanding search processes’ verticals for different business categories in Yelp (and how they created the reorder button).

(26:15) - The perks of being a responsive business owner (and how Yelp facilitates clever questions to be answered by more than one person).

(32:41) - Looking for something wildly different than ice cream: On Yelp’s target diversification and the appearance of new kinds of experiences.

Episode resources

Connect with Akhil through LinkedIn

Yelp

Thank you for listening to Science of Change podcast. Reach out to Kristen through LinkedIn and visit The Irrational Labs website for more information on behavioral science.

This show is presented by SetSail and produced by Kristen Berman and Studio Pod Media. The executive producer is Rachael Roberts. All episodes are written by Kristen Berman and Ying Lin with experts, script editing by Jack viewer. Special thanks to Lydia Trupe for fact checking and citations. Music and editing provided by nodalab.

You’ve probably heard of Asana or maybe you already use it in your workplace. In this episode, Paige Costello, Core Product Leader at Asana, joins the show to explain the features that help codify and amplify some of the key components that make work to actually work. We talk about interesting concepts such as deadline visibility, social loafing, long-term planning and authentic acts of recognition. Let's take a look at what work actually is and which are the most important (and sometimes hidden) gears that create productive work environments!

Jump straight into:

(01:42) - The coordination layer: Asana's role in helping teams plan and achieve their work together.

(05:45) - A visual connection: How Asana’s accurate deadline display turns procrastination into motivation.

(10:05) - Is social loafing a real thing? Team productivity, accountability systems, being evaluated and why public tasks are so effective to overcome social loafing.

(15:28) - Traction, focus and engagement drive: The tools that make it easier to break down big projects into small tasks.

(21:41) - A manager’s best friend: Asana’s insights to make long-term planning and goal tracking easier.

(25:37) - Setting the norm: Templates, updates and other features that help Asana work for every team structure and user.

(31:03) - The power of compliments: Enabling specific and authentic acts of appreciation and the future of collaborative work management.

Episode resources

Connect with Paige Costello through LinkedIn

Asana

Thank you for listening to The Science of Change podcast. Reach out to Kristen through LinkedIn and visit The Irrational Labs website for more information on behavioral science.

This show is presented by SetSail (follow on LinkedIn)and produced by Kristen Berman and Studio Pod Media. The executive producer is Rachel Roberts. All episodes are written by Jack Bueher. Music and editing provided by nodalab.